March 10, 2021

Episode 2 - 256 Barbecue

Episode 2 - 256 Barbecue

We catch up with Ross a chef who runs a social media account 256barbecue and find out what his grill space is, his favourite cooks and we play the first BBQ Bingo of the series.

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Transcript
Dan - Host:

Hello and welcome to the meat & Greet BBQ podcast episode two with myself, Dan aka Welsh man barbecues on Instagram. And also Oh, in back on barbecued on Instagram as well. How are you doing?

Owen - Host:

I'm very well done.

Dan - Host:

Very good indeed. And we are so excited to introduce to you the podcast with our first ever guest on here. Ross, who's a chef, you can find him on Instagram on 256 Barbecue, and he has so much knowledge I've learned so much from this conversation that we've had, what was your favourite thing about this conversation Votto and

Owen - Host:

his passion for food. And I think how he wants to take barbecue from roughhouse both Rough and Ready kind of, you know, on the grill, get it off, have it with heavy Mac, Mac and Cheese, carbs, all that type of thing. But actually, more of a restaurant finesse to barbecue, and I think he's very knowledgeable in his flavour profiles and what works well. So it was great. It was great to hear really that you know, someone within within the hospitality industry taking barbecue to another level. Certainly more so than we do.

Dan - Host:

So much more knowledgeable than us. And that's why I think you guys are going to love this episode. So keep listening. And here's Ross from 256. Barbecue.

Ross 256 Barbecue:

Hey, Ross, how are you? Not too bad guys. How are you? Yeah, very good. It's,

Dan - Host:

it's great to have you on as a first person, particularly being a chef as well. Yeah. Well,

Ross 256 Barbecue:

thank you. Yeah, I really appreciate those kind words. You know, I've been a chef now for 14 years. So kind of really got that culinary hospitality background. And really, my love of barbecue stemmed from when I was a kid, we spent quite a few holidays going to America, more specifically Florida for the theme parks and bits and bobs around there. And that was when I was on holiday there. That was the first time I ever really had smoked food. Because at that point, we're talking early 2000s. So it wasn't, it wasn't big over here, you know? No, at that point to a British person, a barbecue was, you know, charcoal outside, put some burgers, maybe some check in. And that was it. You know, this whole realm of smoked food never really existed. So to go to the States, and you get this like slab of ribs put in front of you and the meats just falling off the bone. You know, as I was probably 1012 years old, that was just like, What is this? What is this magic? Why haven't I got this at home? That's a big thing for me food and memories kind of connect. Yeah. And then as I went through my career, it seemed that every restaurant I worked in had a smoker in some way shape or form, whether it's just, you know, a little smoke box that sits on top of a stove, and you put some wood chippings in and you know, smokes and to one place or worked out that the owner created a smoker out of a old extraction system. So you're saying that every place at work had a smoker in some sense, you know, I was kind of obsessed or like watching YouTube videos about it anything on Netflix, or Amazon or the Food Network on telly, I was always watching it about barbecue. So then, it it took some time to persuade my wife to let me buy my first smoker, because there's always been exactly choose the cheapest one.

Owen - Host:

But it's got to be good quality. If you're going to invest, you've got to invest. Right,

Unknown:

exactly. I mean, obviously there are a lot cheaper smokers out there than what I picked. But obviously I'll get into more detail as we go along but I wanted something that would last not okay, you buy a year out but then you have to buy another one. I apply the same principles of everything like if I buy knives, I use it work, I want them to last I don't want to make I'll use it for a bit and buy another one. The same applies with with you know, with barbecue and you see some units out there when you look at like trainers and they're like 1500 pound for like commodity Joe's big green eggs, you know, but to get a decent unit you have to invest. But yeah, my love of barbecue just came from you know, just trying different foods trying to figure out okay, how do they make it that good? Because I want to make it that good trial error you have to try to recipes and all that but that's part of the fun is not going to be perfect first time.

Dan - Host:

That's what really excites me about having you on board because having a chef straight away. I want to just pick your brain on wood types and different techniques and using different words in different ways. Whether it be chips if you're if you're kind of soaking them beforehand if you're using whole blocks what you You'd advise to get the best flavour profile out of different meats and things. It's all fascinating. And it's great to have a chef here to talk about their experience with it. Really? Yeah, well,

Unknown:

Bobby, any questions you've got guys, I'm more than happy to, you know, to share whatever knowledge I may have, whether it be you know, over words meet, wherever, you know, it's part of my career, I'm because now I'm a head chef, my job is to bring up chefs to you know, get into a level. That's my job. My job is to train chefs. So whatever knowledge or whatever help I can give you guys and give the Barbie huge movie as a whole. I'm all for it.

Owen - Host:

So what, obviously, you mentioned your head chef, and you're obviously it's about training the next chefs, which must give you great satisfaction that you can actually kind of bring the next level, you know, the next generation of chefs in do what sort of cuisines you kind of doing in your day to day role? And how does that transfer over to the barbecue.

Unknown:

I've cut, I went through the standard training, I'm three years at college and then work my art for the rank. So I've kind of got good understanding of good British food with like, the classic French influence from mostly my training was very classical. Because I was never one of these chefs that wanted all the water baths, the backpack machines, or this, what we call molecular, we've got like Heston type stuff, we got all the powders and, and chemicals and all this stuff. I've never really wanted to get into that, because that's more going down a scientific way. I just want to cook. Yeah. So the way I kind of then bring that into barbecue, and you can kind of see it on my page a little bit is, whenever I see barbecue in most of the accounts is not a bad thing, but most of the council follow you see how barbecue is it's kind of me sides. I was like, Okay, how can I apply my Sheffy knowledge to kind of tweak this? Whereas it's still barbecue, there's still that the essence is barbecue, but what can I do so, okay, like one of the things I've had the biggest likes on is I took a smoked chicken and made it into a pie. So normally they just have a smoked chicken, you cut it in half. You got half a chicken, couple of sides, that you chicken dinner, okay, okay. I'm not to make a damn good pie. Why don't I take the chicken from this smoked chicken and put it into a pie. And the results were brilliant. The feedback hack from it was fantastic. And as I'm just trying to put across, if you can just take a step back and think what else you can do with it. You can take that BBQ to the next level of just not just a slab of meat with some sight, but you can do Okay, what else goes with chicken like another dish I've done recently is I may again have smoked chicken but instead of just pack it in half, I took the breast off the bone. carve the breasts are as nicely found out done a butternut squash puree because butternut squash goes with chicken same done some say spinach, chicken spinach, and then done some buttery, roasted fondant potatoes because he doesn't like buttery roasted potatoes. Yeah. So again, it's taking the essence was that smoked chicken, you know, smoked on barbecue, like two and a half, three hours. So it's taking that barbecue, taking it to that next level of okay. It may not be traditional barbecue, but it's taking the barbecue to a new level where it could be going. You know, Britain isn't known for his barbecue. So why can't we take barbecue to a British level and make it a form of barbecue,

Owen - Host:

you can definitely see that on your page. I mean, that that pie, you just mentioned that smoked chicken pie that you've actually put your 256 Barbecue there in writing on there. I am someone that's done some pies recently. And it's not a scratch on what you've done. You can tell you're a professional, you know, just just in the presentation. I mean, I tried to I tried to do some writing and it looked like my four year old child had done it in PE and pastry writing. I just couldn't quite get it done. But one of the other things I saw recently, and again, I think this kind of mirrors what you're trying to achieve with your page is that ham hock to ring. Again, I'm a tradition, I say a traditional barbecue person in the big, big slab of meat, potatoes and salad on the side. And that's that's my Instagram photo pretty much. Whereas you've again you've got that finesse in the you've done the smoking pot, but actually making it into something that is more restaurant worthy. And you know, normally getting in a restaurant as a starter like a Tareen.

Unknown:

Yeah, exactly. The smoked ham hocks very nice. Something we do work a lot. So for okay, I bought a non smoked ham hot, there is no smoke on that at all, turn my smoker right down to the lowest it could possibly go. So it wasn't cooking, it was just flavouring it with the smoke. And then again, using a technique I use at work, just putting the ham Hopkins in stock with peppercorns, time, bay leaves, etc. And cooking it overnight in the oven 98 degrees C and the meat just falls off the button. And then you can form it in its array and you can then use that to put the pie it better. But again, it's a way of taking that barbecue because essentially it's the barbecue. And just just taking against that new level of what else can you do? Like you mean I've got nothing against absolutely before anyone makes their mind or anything I've got nothing against traditional barbecue is one of my favourite things to eat. If you give me a choice over fine dining, or a big hunk of meat was besides, you know, nine times out of 10 that being cooked meats gonna win. I've got nothing against it. I'm just trying to show people what else can be done.

Owen - Host:

So does it work in the same way that what you can do in the barbecue at home? Are you able to kind of transfer that back into your kitchen, you know, at work and also then in your training of other chefs that you can kind of bring what you've what you're trying to do with barbecue.

Unknown:

Yeah, lucky. Luckily enough work at the moment we do have is not an electronics block. At home, it is a massive cast iron stick burner. It's got a main tank, it's got another like cold smoking stack on the side. And it it just runs off pure wood and fire. There's no electronic gizmos are anything on it is literally just wood and find that is it. I've tried a few things on it. And obviously, with the master Bill, you kind of set the tempo Forget it, it runs with this you have to maintain the fire you have to watch the temperature in case it gets too hot. So it's a definitely a lot more hands on. But some of the techniques I'm using at home are things I kind of tweaked and learned at work and learning off the owner of place or work at the moment and you know, showing other chefs about cold smoking and what hot smoking can do it work and there are some chefs that are coming into my kitchen never smoked anything before. So okay, we'll start quite simple. I'll show you how to cold smoke some salmon, which is you know, it's ready to be easy. But then you can go into the rounds of okay, I'll then show you how to maintain a fire. How to work we cook anything from pigeons and dark. You know spatchcock baby chickens. guinea fowl has been no end of stuff we'll see. Yeah, what I've, it's kind of in the other way round. So what I've learned at work are kind of that to use a home as well. And then anything I do at home, I can adapt to things at work. So it's kind of just this almost like knowledge cycle.

Dan - Host:

So flavour profiles, and what you've just discussed there, if you if you're talking about kind of simple, traditional meats, how do you personally go about picking what words you'd use and how you'd use them starting off with like a chicken.

Unknown:

See, again, this is where my kind of Chef brain kicks in. Because I don't know if you guys agree but quite a few of the rubs you can buy there are few exceptions, but a lot of the generic rubs you combined are bought if you don't test them, a lot of them kind of have a similar flavour profile. But a lot of them use the same base ingredients like your smoked paprika, cumin Brown, etc. So they're all kind of similar and I think some of them are quite strong for the meat they're intended to like obviously like you said chicken it's quite a light flavoured meat. So I will personally wouldn't want to bombard that with a load of strong flavours like your paprika, cumin, chilli powder etc. Because then you lose the flavour of the meat. If I'm ordering chicken I want to still be able to taste chicken. So personally, I would use something a bit lighter like in my head the things I'll probably chicken salt, pepper, a little bit of garlic, thyme, sage, lemon, just things that are more compliment rather than mascot. So to enhance that flavour of chicken rather than try and mask it behind a load of chilli powder or other spices. That's kind of the next route I want to go down is showing people how to enhance meat rather than mascot. By all means. Again. I'd love marinated chicken like you you go to a good curry house and the tandoori chicken and things like that you No, it's, it's amazing. But I just again just want to show people the different routes to go down. And each meat has its own flavour profile like pork and sage, pork and thyme, you know pork and pretty much anything sweet. You can even brine it in cider, put it on the pit, anything that's gonna compliment me even like beef for example, we know as British people, beef and mustard, they go together they're meant to be together. When I done some beef, right, some beef ribs recently, I made mon rubber which was just salt, pepper, garlic and English mustard powder. It didn't hide the flavour of beef. I personally fought him hard because I'm giving that beef flavours that are meant to be with that. See,

Owen - Host:

I also think sometimes we kind of underestimate salt and pepper using salt and pepper on its own. And actually how much that can enhanced the meat I mean, I've done like a five kilo piece of brisket and just salt and pepper and and the flavour was great you know you just enough the beef shone through you didn't need all the kind of fancy rubs although I do use them and you know, I'm a big fan of some of the rubs that I've been using recently but I think yeah, sometimes you overlook it you almost think don't use that right unless slathered in chilli this chilli that Yeah, but actually salt and pepper can go a long way but yeah exactly

Unknown:

going back to like the professional kitchen side of things you go into any kitchen you know across the world. What are they seasoning their meat with before it goes in the pan, salt and pepper that is there there's no chilli powder or anything like even when it comes out the oven most of the time say fill it steak. The traditional way in a kitchen finish a steak is with butter thyme and garlic. It's not going to hide the flavour of beef you're enhancing it if someone pepper is good enough to use in you know free Michelin star kitchens is good enough to use on a smoker.

Owen - Host:

definitely agree. So what about like in terms of wood? Do you have like a you know a favourite type of wood that you use for smoking or do you arrange them

Unknown:

I like I do like experimenting with different words I've done it more at work than I have. But the ones I tend to go for at home I've always used Apple word because I love the sweetness that comes through and I mostly cooked pork say you know Apple word, the sweetness report just goes brilliantly and recently I've been using I've always used two thirds apple and 1/3 Hickory because I love the colour that hickory puts on that deep red mahogany colour especially on something like baby back ribs is just beautiful to look at. I tend to go for more fruit words then I do like your bigger flavour like your oak, hickory.

Owen - Host:

I'm a big fan of Apple woods. I've literally got a box of it in my shed just lumps of apple wood.

Dan - Host:

I've been using oak recently, I'm very much even compared to oh and I would say I'm much more of a beginner in my journey with using smoke I've not really been using smoke that long. And I've only really I've had a little bit of apple wood and I've used a lot of hickory and now that I've kind of discovered this oak I very much feel like I'm in that camp until I discovered the next thing but also learning how to use it properly. You don't want to over smoke the flavour as it works is very easy to overpower things if you don't know how you're using it as you've said,

Unknown:

yeah, exactly that is that's part of the fun with barbecues, it's a lot of trial and error we've we've all had cooks that have not worked and you sit there and how does that not work this is exactly same as last time I've done it so why is it not work this time whether it's the meat whether it's the rub the conditions outside because you know like temperature drops outside and you know the temperature in your pet drops. Now there's a lot of factors but it's part of the fun trial and error you might get all this wood you know read reviews and people using it looks really good but then you might try it and it might not be your taste because everyone's got different tastes they know what may be salty to someone isn't salty to someone else. So I might like using Apple word but Dan you might try it and you might not like it it's it's that it all comes down to personal taste as well.

Owen - Host:

And that's definitely I think the biggest draw for me personally around barbecue and taking it taking the barbecue from next level from your traditional British bangers. Burgers and a couple of chicken kebabs and actually going down the hole smoking the big big pieces of meat is every every single Cook is a learn you learn something new, don't you? Every single time Which is great also can be incredibly frustrating when you've poured a load of time and effort into something and it doesn't quite turn out the way. But then you kind of know, don't you for next time what's changed? What's tweak? So good from the

Unknown:

masses. And it always seems the days I'm not smoking, it's almost like a withdrawal symptoms, because out there, I want to either. Yeah.

Dan - Host:

It's great to be outside as well, at the moment, it's so easy to not leave your house over the course of like a week or two. So an excuse to keep going out in that garden into that cooking area is a good thing. A very good thing.

Unknown:

Oh, absolutely. I think, you know, this is now part of hospitality. This is now my third lockdown. And I was quite lucky to have bought my smoker being at the beginning of the last first lockdown back in May. And I think, I think that has a part to play on why, especially over the past year, there have been so many, especially in the UK, so many Barbie accounts that have cropped up. Just because we've had nothing else to do. We've been stuck inside, we've only been able to go and our gardens. Let's cook. You know, we've got all this range of barbecue suppliers and companies popping up. We're going to use them and we're going to cook some damn delicious food. Because we've got nothing else to do. And then it just snowballs and carries on carries on and you get all these amazing accounts popping up. And it's a wonderful thing. Seeing what other people are cooking. Yes, I know, social media gets slated mainly for the wrong reasons and people abusing it. But from the barbecue point of view for me to be able to scroll through and see what people all over the world and in the UK are cooking. To me. That's a wonderful, wonderful thing.

Owen - Host:

Were you surprised at the amount of just the amount of people in the UK that had barbecue accounts and, and some of the amazing like talent, actually that you know is in people's back gardens and what that what they're achieving?

Unknown:

Yeah, without a doubt. When I started by dipping my toe into the water of barbecue, everything I saw was American American American American there was that was kind of the market was there. And then I think I just went on Instagram just typed in like barbecue smoke foods UK or something like that. And it was just pages. I did not think it was that big of a hit. Because even like the restaurant scene, there aren't that many, like Smokehouse restaurants in the UK. It's not one thing. It's popular. So to be able to go on Instagram, and even Facebook as well, and go through and it's like, there's a lot more people doing this and I thought that was it's become one massive, massive community. It's quite refreshing to see social media being used for something good. Yeah, rather than slating someone, you know, it's it's brilliant. Brilliant to see because as we all know, social media can be really toxic at times, but to see it being used for something good and spreading positivity. Who doesn't like looking at food

Owen - Host:

so you've mentioned it a couple of times but what what what's your setup at home? You know what, what barbecues, smokers etc. Have you got?

Unknown:

I have one, it's a master Bill 560 Gravity smoker slash grill. When I went to bought this, I'd done a lot of research about which ones buy because the original one wanted to buy was one of the Bradley cabinet smokers, but has a little briquettes and it goes in reading reviews and whatnot. They didn't get the best review. So I was like, Okay, what else is out there? I kind of wanted something that you can do. Load up set it and not forget about it. But you know, it's gonna stay at stable temperatures, not the fluctuations, learning from others. So I didn't really want to go down the stick burner ropes and I saw a lot of word keep a top top keep the word going. So through speaking to a few people on Instagram and whatnot, everyone was saying that this is Master Builders just come out. Look at it. It runs off word, it's charcoal. It's got control panel, you can just set the temporary one and it will just keep going and going and going. Yes, it's not the cheapest thing to buy thing. I bought it for about 606 50. So being furloughed at the time, it took a lot of convincing to my wife that magnified and I'm sure you guys are running to as well.

Owen - Host:

Yeah. All the time.

Unknown:

One of our conditions was okay, if you get this, you need to do something with it. You can't just have it in the garden. Good for yourself. Like yeah, you know in time what's up Things nailed down and hence the Instagram page and things like that which she is over the moon about. So that is literally the only smoke I have. I don't have a commodity Joe or Trager or anything like that I have one smoker that does everything in cold smoke right down to 150 degrees Fahrenheit, which is about 68 degrees C for cold smoking ampark have cranked up to about 600 degrees kebabs on, it does everything and it hasn't missed a beat in the year I've had it. And you know running off charcoal, you're gonna get that nice smoky charcoal II flavoured juice back from a barbecue and use wood chunks as well. So in it kind of has a hopper stack on the side where you pour the charcoal in. And you kind of do okay, a third of charcoal, few chunks of Word, another bit of charcoal, a few chunks of wood. So as it burns down it the heat gradually catches that word and you see the plumes of smoke coming out. So, Dan, you said earlier about over smoking, this kind of prevents that almost because it's only in layers that that smoke is getting on? It's not a constant bombardment of heavy smoke. Yeah. It's like a full Hopper would give you about eight hours of cooking. So you're talking probably about every two hours if it's a long cook like pork shoulder, something like that. Every two hours, it will be hit with a fresh layer of smoke. Yeah. Which, again, it produces brilliant smoke, beep smoke rings, but it doesn't over smoke, you can still taste the quality of the meat. You're not just tasting smoke. Yeah. And you know, I couldn't be happier with it. You know, it's quite cheap to run. I haven't know, because it runs on electric. I haven't noticed any major differences in like electricity bills and everything like that. He runs off charcoal, which these days is very easy to get all year round off the internet, you only need little chunks of wood. It's not massive, great logs. And it's cooked everything pretty much how I wanted it. Obviously, there's been cooked, I haven't turned out exactly because when I first started, I'd never really smoked at home. So a lot of trial and error. But I haven't really had a cook or anything but I thought I need to buy another one isn't doing what I want to do. It's Hats Off the master belt. And I know they're now releasing, you know, bigger units like the 1050, which is the same gravity fed style. They have hit the nail on head for like, almost set it and forget it smokers when you think you've got like the traders, which is a similar setup, but it runs on pellets. But as I said before, they are expensive units. Yeah, I've heard really good things about them. But they are almost double the price. So to be able to get something that does exactly what I traded us, and more because you can crank up the temperature and grill stuff as well. Like, last weekend, they marinated some chickens are going to curry I turned up to 600 degrees. And it was brilliant. It was perfect. And I cook the chicken through have a nice char marks on the outside. And then I can turn it down and smoke something all day. It's just a fantastic all in one. smoker and grill. And to be honest, I don't feel I would need another one. Because there's really not something that can't do. That makes sense. Yeah.

Owen - Host:

Do you do find? Does it fluctuate the temperature? Obviously, if you're setting it electronically, you know, 200 degrees, do you find it fluctuates much? Or is it pretty, pretty consistent? If you set it it will stay?

Unknown:

That's kind of the only little niggle I've run into because the original on the front of it. It's got a temperature gauge. And it wasn't that accurate. It just kind of said smoked barbecue grill, there's no numbers or anything on so I found a replacement and go exactly saying hold it even drilling or anything like that. And it had numbers and temperatures on it. I found especially in the cold, colder months back in like the start February in January, maybe about 10 to 20 degrees Fahrenheit difference, but I'm just taking that as it was it was minus six outside. Yeah. In colder temperatures, you can expect that fluctuation a little bit. Over the past couple of weeks when it's been a bit warmer. I haven't noticed that as much. That is only the very slight niggle that you might just have to just a temperature slightly if it's freezing cold outside. Apart from that. It's brilliant.

Owen - Host:

If that's the only one thing you can think about then I think that's a that's a pretty good buy. Right?

Unknown:

Exactly. I mean, that is literally the only thing I can buy. I can think you know, it's really it doesn't use a lot of charcoal. It gives a brilliant plan. cook stuff really, really well? Yeah, I can't. Apart from that slight niggle with the temperature, I can't think of anything wrong with it. To be honest.

Dan - Host:

It's someone who has just a standard kettle grill. You are talking witchcraft to me. It sounds amazing compared to what I'm working with and how much attention, I'm having to give things to make sure that I get a constant temperature that's not going to dip off or anything. I can't imagine being able to walk away from my kettle for two hours and be confident it's going to be doing the right things. I mean, apart from trying to add, like moisture and things depending on what you're doing. But it sounds like a particularly in normal temperatures, it will just hold and it will hold for as long as you need it to as long as you keep an eye on the hopper.

Unknown:

Yeah, that's exactly it. I mean, this is one of the reasons I wanted to go for something with this kind of almost set it and forget it. Feature mean, I've done it before I've loaded up the hopper put the pork shoulder on. And I've gone out, I've gotten into town, done some shopping, come back a couple hours later, and it's absolutely fine. There's been no change. The best thing about Masterbuilt smokers is especially in the more recent ones, they have Bluetooth and wireless built in so you can download an app on your phone. And you can control literally everything about that smoker on your phone. So I've been out in Ipswich and I've been able to turn the temperature up and down from about 20 miles away. We had a set timers set the temperature on the probe if I want to turn it off, I can turn it off from my phone and it will turn off you can work on that app you can control everything about that smoker. So it is probably the easiest smoker to use. Even if you're a beginner or an advanced cooker. I would suggest getting a master Bill above most smokers just the fact that is so so easy to use and like you say with like your kettle you have to watch it you have to have enough coals or is it gone off word is a game flavour as the temperature you don't have to worry about that or Masterbuilt you just load it up set the temperature let it go

Dan - Host:

20 miles away and you can affect the temperature was I'm battling with it 10 centimetres away trying to make sure I've got everything right. That's that's just stop selling me barbecues cuz my wife is not gonna be pleased.

Unknown:

I can show you websites that have payment plans that you'll never know.

Owen - Host:

So it sounds like a property Tech Tech lovers dream as well. Not only if you love barbecue, but if it's called the apps and things like that as well. Yeah, all the technology that

Unknown:

goes behind. I don't know what goes in. I think there must be like pixie or something in there. Because when you look at the control panel, there's not a lot to it. So I'm like how, how is that connected to my phone? When sometimes I can't even get my phone to

Owen - Host:

connect to a speaker? Yeah, yeah,

Unknown:

but I control a smoker from 20 miles away. I then there's something magical witchcraft going on in there. But I would say to anyone that's looking to buy a new smoker this year. Look at the master bill. Gravity series. I'm not ambassador or anything from us to bill I have patients with I keep talking, keep talking. I don't want anyone but I would highly recommend anyone that's looking to buy a new smoker this year. Or looking at great one that got just look at the Masterbilt gravity series. They do all sizes, all ranges, just look at them. The amount of light I've built, I've got a rotisserie attachment for mine that like this the rotisserie kit it comes with the rotisserie bark and fit on a 560 or the bigger 1050. So just there's so many options just they are the easiest and best smoker to use. I would highly highly

Owen - Host:

I suppose one final question about the Mossville. I mean, I don't personally know much about them. I've got a Weber kettle, a Weber Smokey Mountain to a bullet smoker. And then I've also got a keg broken keg. How big is the actual cooking area do you get? Can you fit quite a lot of meat you know meat on there?

Unknown:

Yeah, I've got the 560 So it's a smaller one in the range but at the time when I bought it was the only one available in the UK they haven't yet released the 1050. I say easily on the 560 you can easily fit probably four or five racks of baby back ribs easily free or full pork shoulders. You can happily get Four chickens on there. You know so you can cook you know a fair amount of food and it comes with what they call warming racks. So you can have two legs was a food. So you can always have like a brisket on top and then a pork shoulder and bottom. So you can cook multiple things at the same time.

Owen - Host:

And what's not to love? Pork, beef dripping on pork. It's not gonna taste any better than that.

Unknown:

That makes everything taste better. You know all these things. That fat makes everything taste better.

Owen - Host:

That's it and any anyone that does cook barbecue is not a slim person. No, they're very they're no, they usually when they were beginners,

Dan - Host:

yeah, the amount of work the amount of work I've had to put in not to put on like 10 kilos since the start of lockdown and actively Barbecuing is crazy. Absolutely crazy.

Unknown:

Because it whenever you barbecue I'm sure everyone listening is gonna is gonna appreciate this as well. Yep, served up. Well, there's a bit let's just, let's just have that. Well, that tastes really only carry on. You can't just have one mouse, can you?

Dan - Host:

No, no, no. All that

Unknown:

effort and you got to eat it.

Owen - Host:

Also find you can't cook small amounts either. No, no. You can't. Even if it's sausages, I've got 10 I've got I can't cook one or two sausages. You

Unknown:

have to justify firing up the smoke or fire up just to cook to sausages or no packs going on.

Dan - Host:

Do you know what like you saying you can't leave things. So this this has this morning? About 11 o'clock. I started it. I did a tomahawk today. Yeah. Absolutely gorgeous piece of meat that I got from Stilton butchers. Absolutely amazing. But I ate the whole thing. Kilo meat for lunch. That's what I'm doing. I cooked it it basically fell off the bone. It was gorgeous. But there's no way any of that meat was staying once I'd attacked it. No way at all.

Unknown:

It's very hard. Once you're done barbecue to go. I'll just put it in the fridge and have it tomorrow. Nope. Has to be gone now. I can't leave it it has to be gone.

Dan - Host:

And like to try and convince my wife that wasn't slowly boiling my arteries or anything. I was like oh well too bit of spinach. Add that to it. So to kilo of meat and a tiny bit of wilted spinach on the side as I complete meal. I've got this Pittman's there. I'm fine protein and vitamins. That broken green on the side. It's fine. It's healthy. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. But you can't have small amounts of food when you're barbecuing. It's not physically possible.

Unknown:

No, it's not his. I don't understand. Well, I just have a little bit now. No, no, that's not how we work. Barbecue is big. It's meant to fill you up. Like it's so more if you can't just have one bite, because I Oh, that's really okay. Let's have a lot

Owen - Host:

to actually going back to Daniel mentioned. complete meal with a bit of a bit of spinach on the side. What's your ultimate? What's your ultimate barbecue cook? Ross?

Unknown:

Yes, I haven't. When you put this question in the email, I found it took a while to think about it. Because obviously there's a lot of stuff even barbecue. But even at work, my favourite thing to cook is anything pork related. I love pork always have done. I mean anything that gives us bacon is just the best thing ever. I've even got pig tattoo on my arm. That's such a nice. So it would have I would have do two things. One would just be additional pork pork in a in a nice soft roll. Maybe some pickled red onions on top. And just like that would just be perfect. And then next to it. I just want a big bowl of pork belly buttons just to pick out and eat and have a beer next to it. And last me said Doug,

Owen - Host:

I would love to come around your house for that pork. Absolutely amazing. And topping off with some pork pork.

Unknown:

Yeah, just just to have them too. Yeah, they're from a pig, but they're two different so you got the pooled softness of ballcourt and then you've got these little nuggets of just pure pig goodness. Yeah, yeah, that's Yeah, fine. Put down. Exactly. You don't need anything.

Owen - Host:

At actually this is a question for both of you. When it comes to pork, pork, do you eat your do social pork? You know, once you've pulled it, do you then kind of mix it in with a source? Or do you kind of just have it have it plain? What do you normally go?

Dan - Host:

You go first. As a Chef Ross you go first and I'll tailor my answer compared to what the chef says.

Unknown:

I do source but only a little bit. I have had an St. Paul pork Where is drowned in source. personally don't like that. Because the ones I have had you're just tasting the barbecue sauce. You're not tasting the pork. All I do is just put a little bit in and I always make sure it's decent barbecue sauce that I've even made or bought. Because some of the gin more generic barbecue sauces I tend to find they kind of taste the same. So the one I personally go for is from Tuffy stone, it says course by red barbecue sauce is amazing. And it doesn't taste like a generic barbecue sauce. It's quite spicy. It's got the vinegar, it's got the different layers of flavour, which is fantastic. But only source a little bit. Yeah, so it's not dripping in source, but there's source there and make sense. Yeah.

Dan - Host:

So for me, I always think that everyone's palate is different. So I would never want to source something to any sort of level. And it put people off if they don't want sauce, or if they want mountains and things. It's you can always add, but you can't take away. But quite often what I will do is if I've been collecting the juices from the cook, and it's got all of that flavour, I'm not using that flavour, I will reintroduce that to the pulling process. And then whenever people are, if they're serving themselves up the pulled pork in any way, shape or form, then I'll have multiple different sources on the table. They can then add to it. But I personally wouldn't add source to the pulled pork in the first place cuz you don't want people like

Unknown:

you say, Have you ever worked in hospitality because that sounds like a very shattering response.

Owen - Host:

I have been practising he's been practising all week I took him to a chef I must be better.

Unknown:

The way you said you can always add but not take away. That's what I tell chefs about seasoning and things like that. But you can always add more salt where you can't take it out. So I'm completely on your level. I completely agree with that. Because like you say some people might like no sauce. Some people might like a really spicy sauce. Some people might just like a traditional sweet sauce. If you I want to come to your house down because that sounds bloody amazing.

Dan - Host:

Not that long. We don't have to wait that long now. Oh, it will testify. I am obsessed with food before I was even properly barbecuing. I absolutely love cooking. I do the majority of cooking in my house. And that's by choice. Not no arguments at all about who's cooking water or anything. I just love cooking I really really enjoy it almost as much as I love eating it. And if I enjoy eating food that much that I'm going to take a lot of time and effort to learn to get the foods the best level not just for me but other people if other people have to have the meal as well because my wife is not going to enjoy this chicken in the same way that I would necessarily enjoy the taking. For example, I think it's blasphemy. She hates gravy. i That's not okay, that's not okay. And marry her. I know I know I know. But but so for that reason. I've learned very quickly at least cooking in my household everything that you'd normally add you give the people the choice you give them the choice and they can add it themselves as on when they want I think

Owen - Host:

the choices though you either have the gravy you don't have the meat

Dan - Host:

you either have the gravy or you don't have the marriage

Unknown:

comes down to the mile the bane of my careers is bloody TripAdvisor when people bought their opinions on that, it's like yeah, but some people have different tastes to you know what I might like to eat. Dan might not like to eat and might not like to everyone's got different tastes,

Dan - Host:

TripAdvisor, TripAdvisor, so as a chef, I can imagine it must be a nightmare when someone comes in and asks for either a meat probably medium is the worst I think asked for a medium steak thing kicks off if there's any sort of red colouring in there. Because medium there should be pink in there. There should be pink in there for it to be medium and people don't understand

Unknown:

that. Now I've had a few of these. Just to give you an insight my my top three this is one I always loved. Someone came in and said can I have a medium rare steak and no blood? Interesting. I've had someone complain that their apple crumble was too hot. And number one always sits at the top. No one has ever beaten this yet. We had a complaint that our Yorkshire puddings were too light and too airy. What

Owen - Host:

I mean make them denser. Right?

Unknown:

I often I can make your pancake but that's what I was when the manager said and I was like, what? How? i That kinda.

Owen - Host:

It's kind of the whole point. Oh, isn't it you want a like crispy? Yorkshire pudding?

Unknown:

Yeah, true visors a whole nother rabbit Before we could go into

Dan - Host:

well, that's obviously like people failing at understanding what food is or should be, particularly if you're ordering it from a professional standard. But what barbecue fails Have you had?

Unknown:

Oh, my biggest one, and my mom always reminds me of this and if this was if this was like an Instagram live thing, I could probably see her typing it as we speak. When

Owen - Host:

I say this is live

Unknown:

when I was about 15 years old, I just come back from work experience don't work experience at a hotel, you know, and for okay, I can cook a little bit now that we're having a barbecue so I went I went to my parents don't like barbecue. And this was before smoking, you know, just a kettle BBQ put charcoal in puts me on Happy days. So we use you know, instant like charcoal bags, just put the bag in set like to goes. What I didn't think about was the fact that the coal was obviously need time to calm down. So they're not as hot.

Dan - Host:

Yeah, yeah.

Unknown:

I didn't think about that being 15. I just thought, oh, that's hard to put food on. Within about 30 seconds. Everything I put on was just black and on fire. And my mom has never, ever let me forget that. And it was not a brilliant day because the whole dinner went on the barbecue the first few seconds it was on fire. Because it was the coals were that heart that everything just went

Owen - Host:

I think that's kind of the association with British barbecue as well, isn't it? That you? You we cook it? So it's black on the outside pink on the inside? Yeah. Yeah, that firstly, that's not true. But

Unknown:

no. And I think that's where people's perceptions of barbecue are changing. Like, I speak to a lot of people that don't necessarily do smoking. But they instead of having a generic, like kettle barbecue for you buy from being Q that you just lump sum, Charcot Lin, people are now doing research, they're buying webinars, they're buying commodity, buying big green eggs. I think people's general knowledge about barbecue is improving. That is not just Okay, we'll go to Tescos buy some burgers, hotdogs and maybe some pork steaks, and just whack it on always black, that's barbecue. I think, generally, people's knowledge of barbecue is improving. Well, it might not be smoking, but just cooking outside, especially over the lockdowns and things like that, I think genuinely people's perceptions and almost stigma about barbecues and breathing.

Dan - Host:

You know, for me, particularly British barbecue, it's the understanding that these things take time. So I I'm the person who asked people about their barbecue fails, because I learn from that, that's just me, that's how I learned. But I always think it's unfair without talking about any of my fails. And I have a number of them, you know, we could do this podcast 400 episodes, I'd have one for every episode, part of what you've talked about there, at the age of 15 is that misunderstanding of timing, as well as the calls. So something that I did was we had the the in laws were coming over and I was like, right, I'm gonna do a brisket. I've done a brisket once before, and it worked out fantastically, I know the temperatures that I need to hit at different times, etc. So I know it's gonna roughly take the size of me I had I thought was going to take six hours. And then I know I needed to allow at least kind of two hours resting for what I wanted at the time. You can't do that with brisket, because you can't assume there's not going to be a drop in temperature, it's not going to stall at all. So they were coming over at midday, I started to cook at five thinking that I was giving myself plenty of time. And it needed another like hour and a half when after they arrived. And then I had to also explain to them, I have to let this rest I have to I'm not I'm not being pedantic. This is not going to be an enjoyable experience for anyone if I don't let it rest. And that's also an issue when you're cooking for people who want the food ASAP. No, everyone's like that. And to be fair to them. They were really nice about it at the time I cook something else in the meantime. So we were fine and they were over for the whole day. But I hear about it occasionally. Of course I do. And it taught me so much about brisket as well again, those fails you cannot think that one piece of meat that weighs the same as another is going to cook in the same amount of time. And the same conditions. It's not true.

Unknown:

No, you know I completely agree like like I said last week I smoked the whole chicken. I asked my chickens before usually take some round For hours, that chicken cooked in two and a half, so I went out to check it, I probed it. What the hell you've done?

Dan - Host:

Yeah.

Unknown:

And this was like, three o'clock in the afternoon. Okay, I've got like, three hours before dinner. Yeah. So again, like you said, those timings you think okay, so same way comes at the same time. What can go wrong? Yeah, yeah, everything, everything can go wrong.

Dan - Host:

You know what talking about chicken? I would love to get a chef's opinion on this. If you're smoking a chicken or even roasting a chicken. Yeah, how long should you rest that chicken because certain meats, it's rested for as long as you're cooking it. Chicken. So many people don't even bother resting at all, which I think is criminal, but they just they just don't. How long should you have so chicken for?

Unknown:

See, the general rule of thumb I always got torn in kitchen is you rest that me for half the amount of time it was cooked. So say a chicken took you roasting it in an oven. For example, it takes an hour and a half, I would then rest that for at least 45 minutes. But again, something like a brisket that takes 16 hours, you're not going to let it rest for eight hours. As it differs because like a brisket or pork shoulder, anything that's taking a long time. I personally would probably give it at least an hour and a half. Because it's had so long and that smoker, those muscles are just tight. They're all tightened up because we're gonna expose the heat. So that in theory, the longer you can give it to relax, the softer that meat is going to be. Chicken, people that don't rest. They they shouldn't be cooking. That's not fair.

Dan - Host:

But you think of the classic Sunday roast. It is known that for generations, the chickens done you pull out the oven and then they serve it in the next 20 minutes with everything else that happens so much but that is so wrong to me and it's upsetting to see.

Unknown:

Yeah, I completely agree when he's especially when you see like cooking shows on TV and they pull a chicken or turkey strap the oven is on the table and someone's carbon

Owen - Host:

leftovers are a fantastic thing with barbecue.

Unknown:

Without a doubt. I mean, generally the leftovers you can make pretty much anything but when it comes to barbecue, you've already got that extra level of flavour that you'd have, say, like you've roasted chicken on a Sunday. leftover roast chicken is amazing. But if you've got leftover smoked chicken as even that those you can then use that okay, if you got leftover smoked chicken can make the pie you can make a decent pasta sauce. What I've done before is I had some leftover smoked chicken shredded up, put it in a white sauce with some mushrooms and leeks and put some mashed potato on top bake that through the avenues almost got like smoked chicken shepherd's pie type thing. That was brilliant. I mean, if you've got leftover pork pork, you can put it for a stir fry. You got leftover leftover beef, you know, make some Yorkshire puddings. But that beef inside of Oxford was gravy. You know?

Owen - Host:

I'm so I'm so hungry, right?

Dan - Host:

Do you know what? So this is the second episode of our podcast. Why didn't you ask me that last week going because a big part of my Instagram is leftover meals with barbecues because I as much as I love barbecuing, I wanted to find something different that I hadn't necessarily seen much of on Instagram. Now unfortunately I ate the tomahawk I there's not much I can possibly do with that. But I try and if I'm doing a big Cook, then my next three Instagram posts are going to be what else I'm doing with that meat and how I'm using it and the different ways that you can store it afterwards and still reuse it because particularly British people I think are so afraid of using leftovers so afraid and don't know how to store them.

Unknown:

Yeah, that's a big thing from almost like media in the 80s and 90s. Where by if you didn't cook, something well done is going to kill you. If you don't eat on that day is going to kill you. Well, no, if you look into it, just make sure it's cooled down in the fridge covered in clingfilm. You can easily get free to five days out.

Dan - Host:

Yeah, and that's before you even start looking at like using your freezer. I'm not saying the quality of meat is going to be anywhere near as good once you frozen it but the flavour profile still there, if you're going to be doing something like Polonaise or Riku, anything like that a chilli at a later date, and you've got some leftover brisket in that freezer,

Unknown:

right? You know, it's it's knowledge and the reason you went down there similar to myself in trying to do something different that you don't see on Instagram that will help people what you're doing will help people realise, okay, I don't have to do the same thing with this leftover brisket. I don't have to reheat it anything, I can make it into something else. So what you're doing there is again having so the barbecue community, which is an amazing thing.

Dan - Host:

As long as it looks okay, because if it doesn't look okay, then it's not gonna be seen by people.

Unknown:

You got to make sure the pictures right to the ground get the right angle, the right lighting.

Dan - Host:

It's again, I was saying in our last episode, the one the other rule that I have with my Instagram is I don't use filters. Because I this is how it looks. You can achieve this yourself. I haven't I haven't boosted anything. I haven't used a different filter. So it looks different. This is what it is. Even if I've messed it up. This is what it is.

Unknown:

Yeah, I completely agree with you. I'm exactly the same I do not use a filter. Because then you're kind of tarnishing what people may be able to achieve. By some accounts I follow. You can see from even the photo Nikon post, it's almost a professional looking picture where they've got all the backlight and the backdrop and they got professional camera looking over it and things like that. And part of me is thinking, are you actually going to eat that? Or is that going to go stone cold where you're taking all these different pages or all these different angles? I never use a filter my all my pictures are taken on my phone. You know, I just got a Samsung Galaxy phone. Just use that. Take a picture put on Instagram. I want to do that as quick as I can. So I can eat that food. Yeah, I don't want the food very cold. I want to take the picture. I've already went even uploaded to Instagram, then I take the picture. Check it. Yep, that's good enough. Do any? I don't

Dan - Host:

know that those beautiful pictures. They do make me hungry. And they do make me want to cook. But I like to think that at least myself. I know that I'm never going to achieve that exact look. But I don't know how many people understand that.

Unknown:

Yeah, yeah, I completely agree with you on that. But that's why I turn it edge towards the more natural accounts where you can like yourself, you can see. Okay, this is someone doing it in the back garden. They've taken a picture. There's no filler. It looks homemade. Doesn't look like I don't wanna say that. But it hasn't looked like

Owen - Host:

he's hiding chicken. Yeah,

Unknown:

it hasn't had a look though, isn't the lighting looks like it looks organic is the word and it looks like something you've made yourself taking a picture and you're uploading it. And that's the best content because it's honest content. That's what that person has made. It may not look as pretty as another post. But I bet you something but it tastes bloody delicious. Yeah, and that is the most important thing. Yeah, if a post you can have the best looking post in the world, but it might not taste good. But if it's an organic post that you yourself put up you know that's going to taste delicious. Let's be honest, because it's honest food.

Dan - Host:

We've talked so much about food, but something that I think a lot of us are passionate about and is also important is what you're drinking alongside that food. So what are you drinking not just now if you are having to be drinking something right now, but what are you pairing with your meals for example your last barbecue cook what did you pair with it and why?

Unknown:

See, I'm a suffered boy born and bred so I stick with a local my favourite ales are for adnams, especially Gosha they are my favourite. So with the lighter things like your chicken, your pork I tend to go for an ale I'm not a massive lager drinker because I personally don't like so yeah, with the lighter like you pull bought things I'll always go for an Adam's a or whether it's go ship broadside, something like that. They're my favourites. If I'm having beef, I tend to go to Guinness. Guinness is one of my favourites to have just a nice glass of silky ice cold Guinness is a wonderful, wonderful thing. When the weather gets better outside I have got a kind of a plan to do a few more food and drink pairings. So trying to find like local beers, local wines, etc. That kind of promote Suffolk a bit more as well. So nice. Put a small side so in con, like smoking fish or something I find a nice wine to go with it. If I'm doing pull pork or find a Suffolk beer to go with it. It's all about promoting what you use locally and what you'd like to drink as well.

Owen - Host:

Definitely local is important as

Dan - Host:

well. That being said, I love myself in Belgium beer. I love Belgium. So for example, today I've been drinking left blonde, just I mean, it's a pretty easy get hold of Belgian beer, but I do drink a lot of beer. And it's what I keep going back to. I don't know if I'd say it necessarily pairs perfectly with food. But I want to know that I'm tasting something different as well. Yeah.

Owen - Host:

I'm trying something new. So ISIS, I subscribe to flavour Li. So I get a craft beer sent every single month. And today I'm trying to BlackBerry wheat beer. I'm not sure what. Yeah, I'm not sure what meat I'd put it with. To be honest. It's quite sweet. Pork.

Dan - Host:

Yeah, I

Owen - Host:

suppose. So. I mean, it tastes it tastes really good. It's bye. Bye brewery called First chop, based in Manchester. But yeah, Blackberry beer. I recommend giving it a go. That's the only

Dan - Host:

thing I've only ever seen. The only meat I've seen BlackBerry with myself is pork or I think game actually, I think I have seen it used with some game as well. Otherwise, I can't think of BlackBerry being used that much with other meats,

Unknown:

BlackBerry, kind of hitting on the chef knowledge BlackBerry will go with like you said game meats, especially venison. One thing I under the choice is duck on a smoker and blackberry and duck goes really, really well. So think of your stronger flavoured meats like your venison, duck, even beef it can work with. So anything that's got a strong flavour BlackBerry will help that because blackberries are sweet, sharp, so help counterbalance and strong.

Owen - Host:

And smoke targets so good as well.

Dan - Host:

I do have duck, I absolutely love duck.

Unknown:

I've got a little bit of a different plan for that. Not just, you know, there's nothing wrong with it, put a duck on let it cook and then shred it. And it's beautiful. I've got something a little bit different plan for it. So you have to wait.

Owen - Host:

Well have to you'll have to tag us in to so we can manually grab it for you.

Dan - Host:

One thing I would say is you might have something planned. But I know oh in has something that he's been talking about wanting to introduce the different guests. And particularly the fact we've got a chef off the bat is gonna hugely, I think make this more fun depending on how it goes. Because you're probably gonna have more knowledge of what you can do with these things.

Owen - Host:

Okay, we heard Yeah, so we want to play barbecue bingo. Yeah, it's not actually bingo, but it sounds good. So what we've what we wanted to do is kind of almost like set you a challenge. So I'm going to spin a wheel, different different types of ingredients, and we'd love you for them to go away. Cook something on the barbecue with that tag is in use the hashtag barbecue bingo and Meet Meat & Greet BBQ podcast will then repost it and just get a bit of social interaction. Go Yeah. We'll be interested to see what you what you're going to cook. So what I'm going to do, I have pre loaded my spinning wheel. We haven't gotten too abstract really, with with some of the ingredients, we could have gotten a lot worse, but as your first guess for us, we thought we'd you know, ease you into it.

Unknown:

Yeah, bring on challenge because this is

Dan - Host:

a bit visual. I just want to say with a chef I will be quite upset. After we've discussed if brisket or pulled pork comes up from this

Owen - Host:

list.

Unknown:

Do you guys deal if it lands on a brisket or pork? Spin it again? Because I want a challenge. I want something a little bit out of the ordinary.

Dan - Host:

Okay, okay, I've got an idea in mind but yeah, go on click let's see what happens.

Owen - Host:

Okay, here we go.

Dan - Host:

Well, wonderful silence

Owen - Host:

course report book.

Dan - Host:

I knew it. I knew it. I knew it. Alright, let's give it one more go. If it lands on one of those two again, I'd like to set a challenge. All right, let's do it's coming back round in 202 pulled pork right,

Owen - Host:

we're talking we're talking about barbecue fails.

Dan - Host:

Well, look, I would love to see you do a cake particularly if you can do a cake that you get those smoke profiles in without destroying the cake. Okay. Particularly if you've got a machine or machine maybe not the right word but like your your smokesation your grill that allows you to hold the temperature because that surely is the biggest issue if you're trying to barbecue a cake is holding that temperature.

Unknown:

Yeah, yeah, I've got something in mind already. I can do.

Dan - Host:

Exciting. Yeah, definitely.

Owen - Host:

Fantastic

Dan - Host:

one thing that oh in and I hadn't discussed. Do you have any questions for us all about what we're doing about barbecuing about just something you'd love to talk to with people about food? Really?

Unknown:

Okay, well, I've got two that's bringing to mind. How long have you guys actually been like smoking a barbecue?

Owen - Host:

I started smoking about March last year. I've been barbecuing for years. Traditional British barbecue. Yeah, just got really excited about trying something new and the fact that we were going to be at home for the foreseeable future. I thought why not try something else? So I'm a massive web of fan and I did a research into you know, what the smoke was I wanted and I went for the 57 centimetre. Yeah. Bullet smoker, Weber Smokey Mountain. The rest is history. I love that bit of kit. And the last year, my my knowledge is really, really expanded. And I Yeah, take inspiration from people like Aaron Franklin. No, I think he's an absolute genius when it comes to barbecue, and I'd love to go to his restaurant, you know, in Austin, Texas, and a flurry plan to actually do that. And I think he's given me a lot of inspiration

Dan - Host:

for myself, smoking wise. And this kind of more recent obsession with barbecuing, really started August time now I've been barbecuing, but using a gas barbecue regularly at home for about four or five years beforehand. And the reason that I wasn't using charcoal was purely because I'd get home from work. And if I wanted to do a barbecue after work, by the time I'd lit the thing, got it how I wanted particularly as I didn't have that much experience with actually using the charcoal myself and getting it started and everything. It could be like eight, nine o'clock, particularly if I wanted to go to like the gym after work or something. Whereas with a Gas BBQ, I could be in that door, I could have something on the table in 20 minutes to half an hour if I wanted to depending on what I was working with. However, as I've mentioned before, oh in here, we work together. We've known each other for years, and we've had each other over for years for barbecues. And we always used to have this joke about I would say that he wasn't actually barbecuing, he was using a firepit because he was using woods and charcoal and everything. And he would say that I'm just using an outdoor oven, rather than barbecuing. But now I knew that I had the time to learn the skills and play with it. I wanted to go back to charcoal, where I grew up in Wales, my father every single weekend, if the weather was good enough for it had a brick barbecue in the garden, and he would use it and he would he wouldn't smoke on it. So I had no experience in using woods like that. But he would regularly do whole fish on it. He would do chickens on it. He used to do so much stuff on it. Like it not blew my mind. I found it so surprising about maybe eight years ago, when people like What's this squeaky cheat Hulu me? Why is this not in our lives, whereas I'd been having it at home since the age of like seven or eight in the 90s. And he was just wanting to elevate that because I'm so obsessed with food. And it was an area of my cooking repertoire that I felt wasn't up to the level that I wanted it to be. But also, I wasn't getting the flavours that I wanted. Like I physically couldn't smoke on that gas barbecue. There was no way I was going to do a beer can chicken or even like a roast chicken on it. You know I could spatchcock it but the amount of gas I'd be using to do it. I may as well do it inside the only thing I'm getting is stood outside which isn't a bad thing. Don't get me wrong, being outside is great. But I'm not getting the flavour that I would be from using those words from smoking from enjoying that and the whole pastime so really, end of August 2020 was when I started really getting into it experimenting with woods,

Unknown:

in your opinion and all all the barbecue meats and everything, all the meat you can put on a smoker. What do you think is the most over rate that people go on about, but you don't think is actually that brilliant. It's personal. But I just really interested to find out what what you guys actually probably don't like or don't think should be done on a smoker, etc.

Owen - Host:

beef short ribs. Oh, yeah. And I think that's if if you if if I was the one that was coming on to someone else's podcast and they asked him about my epic fails, short ribs are my fails, I just, I see, I see so many posts about how amazing short ribs are. And I've done them two or three times now and I just, it's just not for me, I just don't get it. I can't do them very well, I think. And that for me makes it feel a bit overrated.

Dan - Host:

Mine was a lot more recent. And it upset me when I found this out. And it wasn't a fail because I got out of it what I wanted to, but I didn't enjoy the meal anywhere near as much as I thought I would. So I really like turkey. And I have a turkey every Christmas and I have two other meats with it normally, and people tend to laugh for me that I'm doing three meats now, and this year, I did a brisket and a turkey for Christmas. And it was amazing. I've always wanted to smoke a turkey leg. Always wanted to I like the idea of you've got this big thing as well, like leave man, it'd be great. So a few weeks ago, I did one and it looked amazing. And the first few bites tasted amazing. The further into that meat I got and it was cooked through it was to temperature and everything. I just enjoyed it less and less every bite. I don't know if it's because of the amount of smoker taken on. Or just the fact it was literally the same thing. But compared to everything else that I've done. That's the cook that went that looked amazing. The first bite was to die for. But I struggled to get through the whole thing, which for me is rare. Yeah.

Unknown:

Ross See, mine's gonna be really really controversial. I might get a little bit of backlash on this.

Dan - Host:

I think it was gonna be and it might upset me.

Unknown:

I personally I think the most overrated thing that goes on to smoke is brisket.

Dan - Host:

Yeah, I knew you're gonna say that. I knew you're gonna say that. I think I know why, but I'll let you talk.

Unknown:

A personal point of view. From what again from Chef knowledge. Obviously, brisket, something you slow, slow cook, it's not something you can cook quickly. Every time I've cooked briskets it's been a low, slow cook for the oven loads of herbs, vegetables, garlic, red wine, beef stock. You bring out that stock you've got infecting that to make a gravy and then you've got this beautiful beef that just falls apart and it's lovely, beefy goodness. Whenever I've had uncooked brisket on a barbecue, it's never wowed me. I've never eaten a brisket and gone. This is the best thing ever. In fact, I don't really like the taste of smoked brisket. That's my personal thing. I prefer it through an oven cooked in stocking, in fact, and doing one tomorrow for lunch, where it's you know, it's cooked in stock, it takes on the flavour or there's herbes or red wine, everything like that. And I see on Instagram and everyone is raving about briskets and how much good quality briskets cost to smoke as long as they're not exactly the cheapest. I don't get it. I think smoked brisket is quite overrated for as

Owen - Host:

I can I can understand. Yeah, I mean, I love brisket, I love to brisket. So I won't agree with you. But I can, I can understand perhaps why. There's a lot of things that can go wrong with brisket. And when you are paying 4050 quid for a cut of meat, you want to make sure that you enjoy every you know, every ounce of it. And there's a I think there's a lot that you need to nurture with it as well. You've got to wrap it at certain times and people wrap it differently as well. I personally use butchers, butchers paper or peach paper but other people you know will be used for your but some people don't wrap it at all. Yeah, it's I think there's so many variables as well that if you've had a couple of bad pieces I can imagine, I suppose same as what I've just said about short ribs. You're off.

Dan - Host:

So my thing with brisket is I think the reason people in the UK go mad for brisket is it's not part of our normal cuisine. It's actually quite difficult to get hold of brisket or at least a decent cut of brisket. It's rare in the UK to be going round a supermarket and actually have access to brisket readily in any of the meat aisles at all. And if you do, they're much smaller cuts. And we have no idea what to do with it, how to treat it or anything. So there's a level of research that goes into it first, and then the flavours you get are so different. If you do it on a barbecue, particularly if you've robbed it, if you've kind of married it with mustard before you put the robe on if you've done all that the night before. So it's got a chance not only to take on the flavours, but then also the salt gives it kind of like a brine before you even start smoking it. It's so different to other beef that we have access to in the UK. It blows people's mind, even if you don't understand, well, you could do that with other meats. It's just you've not spent any amount of time researching that first. Yeah, I think that's why that's also why I love brisket. Because I'd never had it before I'd had it on a barbecue. I've just wasn't part of the cooking repertoire in my life at all. I'd always wanted it but also to get hold of a decent brisket cut in regards to like the fat content over here compared to what you see in like America. Yeah, makes a huge difference to the tenderness as well. Like before we even start talking about how you wrap it How long do you rest it for? Like what do you do about the stall? How should you react to that piece of meat? How soft should it be? Do you pull it? Or do you cut it into slices? So before I even go into that sort of level, but it's much different to what people normally have in the UK, so I think it blows people's mind.

Unknown:

Oh, yeah, don't get me wrong. I can see why. Why people like the brisket. And like you say it's incredibly difficult over here to get decent cut. When people when English people think about brisket, it's in the meat aisle. It's already VAT packed rolled. Ready, just put it in your stock goes in the oven. That brush that you have there is very different than brisket that the Americans use the Americans is cut in a different way. So you've got the flat and the point it's got a lot more fat on it. The cows in the states are fed on different food than they are over here. Which means though a lot fattier, it's a lot bigger than me. And when you ask that for a while USDA or prime cut American brisket like you say you do pay for it can be you know 50 pounds upwards mean some websites have been on their 150 quid for whole brisket which if I'm spending 150 pound on a piece of meat I want the best meat tasted

Dan - Host:

and the amount of risk the amount of risk with that brisket because you can have the best quality meat but so much can go wrong with that cook. Is it worth the risk? 450 quid

Owen - Host:

No, I know. I know people can't obviously see this because it's a podcast but you're wearing an Angus annoint t shirt. Shout out to Hankerson week and the mote the most recent brisket I did I use their dirty cow

Dan - Host:

that Rob I love that Rob so much.

Owen - Host:

That was great for brisket. So if you've not if you've not done a brisket where you've used that cow rub, give that a go. It was it gave an awesome bark.

Unknown:

Yeah, I've never used it on the fact I don't have the day cow one but pretty much every cook I do have an Angus annoying rub there somewhere. I've tried a lot of rubs from UK companies from American companies. They are without a doubt the best ones I've ever used. So their seasonings are brilliant. They're not too salty, not too sweet. From a chef point of view, everything's balanced all the flavours are balanced there's nothing overpowering or if they are just fan tastic rubs to us. So massive massive shout angers annoying because

Dan - Host:

the shaky cow I think what elevates it in regards to brisket is the coffee notes in there so many other rubs that you get for beef do not have that level of the bitterness and the umami that it brings through and also how it actually changes the feel of the meat I don't know if you'd agree on but it's definitely that that coffee feel in there is different to anything else that I've put on brisket it changed it elevates it

Owen - Host:

yeah and I've made some brisket rubs myself and I think like you said earlier Ross about trying to make make your own you know make your own rubs and flavours it's more recently that I've got into kind of buying like Angus and Lincoln some other you know UK based spices I always used to do my own but they are by the by far the best that I've tried and yeah if you haven't tried that dirty cow one I think it will take the beef to the next to the next level for sure.

Unknown:

So this is one thing I love about the barbecue community. We're sitting here, just discussing all the things we're using, and giving advice to each other on what we should use.

Owen - Host:

It's so great to be part of, and I just hope it continues to expand.

Dan - Host:

So one thing we haven't touched on, and talking so much about Instagram and the barbecuing community, talk us through you on Instagram. You've already mentioned a bit about your background and everything, but really let our listeners know what you're about what you're doing, where they can find you what you've got planned and why they should also get involved.

Unknown:

So I've got two accounts on Instagram, I had my original account, which is a personal if you will account it's at Chef Ross cook all one word. So that's where you'll find more my not so much a moment something that work but more things that will come out my professional kitchen so all the restaurant dishes and anything to do with Chef life, and any of my other interests will come from that one. If you want to throw off my barbecue goodness, which is how we got connected. Then you want at 256 Barbecue. It's on Instagram, it's also on Facebook. Yeah, all my posts go on. Now I do stories most days and try to post two or three times a week. Be licenced like I said I've had that account since I think about 25th of January this year. And just trying to be honest put up one cooking and cooking most of the time for me my wife and my mom. That's it. I'm not smoking in a restaurant. It's just honest, barbecue done in my backyard and I've got a few things planned coming up with a few bits in the freezer I wanted to do so that the poor pork I've got some chicken wings as well I want to do for wing Wednesday. I got some chicken Fi's and I've got a recipe for something from a chef friend of mine which I'm not going to divulge but I want to do that soon. And then like you said there's something a bit out the box with duck I wonder as well but I don't want to give too much away because I want it to be a surprise and hopefully it works. I don't want to announce it. I look like a tear if it doesn't. Of course there's the cake. I've been set by you guys so that Yes.

Owen - Host:

Can you have meat cake?

Unknown:

I've never heard of a meat cake. I'm sure you probably could.

Dan - Host:

I think it depends I reckon a bacon make maple cake would work very very well. How you put it together or whether you'd make a sponge and almost paint it and dust it with a maple and the bacon I don't know. But it feels like that's a sweet thing that would work well.

Unknown:

I've seen I maple and bacon glazed doughnuts where they've made a doughnut dipped in icing and dipped in baking bits I've seen that Yeah, I suppose we wanted like a meat cake he could cook some crispy bacon chop it up and put it through the cake mix and bake it

Owen - Host:

we really love we really look forward to seeing what you're gonna we're going to cook and all the other things you've got planned around the duck the poor pork going to be exciting. It was great to have you on on the show. Thanks for being our first guest

Dan - Host:

Yeah,

Unknown:

thank you for having me on. Thanks for asking me it was a bit out of the blue when I got sent the message so yeah, you guys want me

Dan - Host:

to come back we more than happy to thank you so much for coming on.

Unknown:

Thank you for having me guys. I love doing this like setting time you want me back more than happy to

Owen - Host:

thanks very much for us so that concludes our episode of meat & Greet BBQ podcast. It was a great to hear from Rosser to five six barbecue. As he mentioned, check him out on Instagram and see the upcoming cooks that he's got planned. Also the challenge that we've set into cooker cake on the barbecue. You will be able to find more about the podcast on our Instagram channel app meat & Greet BBQ podcast and follow the hashtags meat & Greet BBQ podcast and also BBQ bingo. You'll be able to see what Ross and all of the upcoming guests and what they're going to be cooking. We look forward to tune in next time.

Dan - Host:

Please do reach out to us through Instagram and even direct message us if you have any questions or even if you'd like to get involved somehow we'd love to hear from you. This is for the community and we just love doing it. Thank you so much for listening